shamory

Scott Sibley – SHAmory Card Bitcoin Card Game

Scott Sibley talks with Rob McNealy about his new Bitcoin themed card game called SHAmory, which he describes as the “classic game of Memory meets the world of Bitcoin.”

Scott Sibley – SHAmory Card Bitcoin Card Game Transcript

Scott Sibley - SHAmory Bitcoin Card Game

Note: This transcript was automatically generated by artificial intelligence (AI) and therefore typos may be present.

Rob McNealy – RobMcNealy.com 0:01
Hey folks Rob McNealy here. And today I’m pretty excited because we are talking to Scott Sibley. He is the creator of a new Bitcoin game called shomrei. And it’s a stem game. And one of the things as a lot of people here don’t know that I actually homeschool my kids and we homeschool our kids because we believe that STEM education is vitally important, not only for giving our kids lots of options, but we believe that the United States is long term losing its edge competitively in the world because we are so weak on STEM. And so when I heard Scott was building out this cool game, and you know, not only to talk about STEM, but it’s a Bitcoin cryptocurrency kind of game. I wanted to get him on the show. So Scott, welcome to the show. How are you today?

Scott Sibley – SHAmory 0:49
Great, Rob. Thanks for having me. Excited to jump into SHAmory, homeschool, STEM all the fun topics.

Rob McNealy – RobMcNealy.com 0:55
Well, that’s a lot of stuff to dive into. So I think before we jump into it VAT, we got a lot to unpack, I think, who are you? How did you get into crypto? And how did you get into making a game?

Scott Sibley – SHAmory 1:08
Yeah. So my tales kind of all come together in very strange ways, but they at least make sense to me. So I’m out here in San Diego actually originally graduated with a degree in accounting, and worked in public accounting for three years, from 2005 to 2008. So before Bitcoin was ever even a thing, but if I really think hard about it, that’s probably where some of it started to get ingrained, where it was literally my job on a daily basis, to go into these companies, audit their financial records, and make sure that they’re, they’re verified, they’re accurate, and being able to have that traceability back to them. So if I think about it, some of my interest was probably piqued then unknowingly. But from there, I’ve been in the edtech space for the past couple of years. I have a lineage of teachers and my family in various scales, Premier League k 12 or reach Tired, and just a mixture of my interest in both sides of things. And then in 2017 2018, like a lot of other people got sucked in until the bull run. I like to think that unlike a lot of other people to what’s happened since then didn’t push me away, it only kind of made me want to dig deeper into learning about everything that’s going on. And then as I got deeper into that learning aspect of it, I really said, Okay, I want to, I want to try to give back in some way try to create something so that that next generation can have be able to do this and hopefully easier and more fun engaging way for hopefully all at all ages. So the card game while yet kids can play it, adults, teenagers shouldn’t matter on being able to use a tool like this. And that was kind of the jumping start to where the game came from.

Rob McNealy – RobMcNealy.com 2:46
So edtech, tell me a little bit about that. What are you doing in the educational technology space?

Scott Sibley – SHAmory 2:51
Yeah, so currently, and for the past number of years, our company has been focused on a product, it’s called journeys map. It’s literally a mapping for traffic. You’re no different than Google Maps. But instead of using that map to get your driving directions to a restaurant, the other side of town, you’re actually using it to go through your learning continuum from grade school all the way through career. So those become the territories if you will. And then each of those territories, the GPS coordinates are occupations, skills, knowledge, abilities, certifications, and so those, that’s how the driving directions can start to get built. And then each location ultimately has a dashboard component where you can start learning more about whatever it is you’re trying to look at. So it’s a lot of mimicking a typical geographic mapping infrastructure, but putting a lifelong learning continuum in boy and being able to recognize whether it’s a homeschool parent, traditional k 12, student, military in transition, career transition, which obviously is going to be happening more and more given the changing environment around us with the pandemic. Lifelong Learning is something that we’re all going to keep doing. And that’s the purpose between building out a map like this so that it can be used by anyone, anywhere, anytime.

Rob McNealy – RobMcNealy.com 4:04
Did you found that, are you the founder of that company as well?

Scott Sibley – SHAmory 4:07
So my dad actually is the founder of that one. So I work there as well as the director and kind of head up the roadmap side of things, sales marketing. We’re a smaller team right now and kind of that startup phase that’s been spun out of a company that’s been around since 1990.

Rob McNealy – RobMcNealy.com 4:23
That’s really cool. Probably don’t know this, but I was a geography major. So I’m really into cartography and geographic information systems. So my mind thinks visually that way. So I definitely want to check out what you’re doing there. But I think lifelong learning is important. One of the things that I’m concerned about is the future of our country. And what I see is, you know, I think our country’s failing educationally on so many levels. And and I’m not just going to throw a public school under the bus though I certainly do from time to time, but I think ultimately We have something wrong with our culture that doesn’t seem to care about education. And I mean, real education, I mean, real mastery of, you know, basic concepts. I’ve heard recently that, you know, the illiteracy rate in the United States is increasing. You know, we’re we’re losing our edge technologically going forward. And to me, you know, it’s, it’s we don’t foster or at least have a communal value set around education. I mean, what are you seeing out there? I mean, just being crazy and a radical homeschooler. I mean, am I am I really seeing something out there?

Scott Sibley – SHAmory 5:38
No, I, you’re, you’re correct. And, like you said, it’s not to put blame on any one system, whether it’s k 12, higher ed, traditional systems, it’s just a volcano erupting all at once in one way, especially with what’s happened over the past few months with everybody having to find new ways to learn and try to balance that with your typical day to day life of being potentially professional and going to work. But a lot of what we’re seeing also is a recognition of those issues. And then by the organizations, institutions, industry leaders, the ones that are going to really survive this next change are the ones that are saying, Okay, one, we need to come together and do this has one. So that industry professional, let’s say you’re, you’re in the cybersecurity industry, so a booming industry that’s out there. They’re expecting, there’s about 500,000 open cyber positions today, high skilled high wage, that part A that problem is the typical grade school student probably has no idea that cybersecurity is a very valuable industry to take a look at. Because the teachers who are sitting in that environment aren’t used to thinking in that box they’re used to doctor, lawyer, accountant for, for lack of better words. And part of it is the awareness factor of saying those industry leaders need to bring Have that awareness back down to the K 12. Teachers, the homeschool parents, however, that’s happening so that the five year old today can know that cyber AI advanced manufacturing or pathways that in the future are going to be there for cyber there. They’re expecting in 2020 to 3.3 million open positions. Just look at that growth and think about the possibilities that are there is one easy example.

Rob McNealy – RobMcNealy.com 7:26
Well, it’s interesting because you know, my wife and I both have advanced degrees. I got an MBA, my wife was an MD. And it’s interesting, like I take my hobbies very seriously. And last summer, I graduated from a full time year and a half long welding program. I went to the back to community college. So I joke around in my Twitter that I’m an MBA welder. I don’t do welding for a living. I do like I like to make stuff. Yeah. So but I really wanted to learn to make stuff really well. So I went through this welding program, and even in there like, one we don’t you know, we don’t teach Or even Foster, you know, blue collar kind of jobs or trade skills and things like that. And we’re losing out. I grew up in the 80s and 90s, in Detroit during the time that the auto industry was starting to offshore, like, especially during the 80s. And it was interesting is that, you know, so I grew up around people that worked in shops and had skilled but those those jobs are dying. And it was interesting. So I went through this program and I literally was older than my instructors. I was the oldest guy in my class at the welding school. And I’m just like, I’m always looking for opportunities. And I was surprised at you know, the how much money a welder can make. And you know, of course, the instructors who also were not entrepreneurs, or at least thinking like an entrepreneur, they would go through and they would say, Oh, well, you can go be a welder and do this and this and then, and I’m like, but you’re not even talking to these kids about being independent welders, about going out and starting your own shop or, you know, buying your own truck and being a mobile welder. Where you can make literally hundreds of thousands of dollars a year with a little bit of investment and and then I started talking to some of the guys and I’m like I didn’t realize this but there’s a whole well track for being an inspector and then being an expert witness and you know those kind of jobs with you know, 510 15 years experience can make hundred 50 200,000 a year welding and you literally don’t need a college degree. And like so you can start and the cool thing about my program and this was shocking to me Scott, as you know, it was a nighttime program so it was designed for guys that work itself. So within a year and a half and like six grand that you pay along the way you can work a full time day job go to school, and they were poaching students out of the welding program from some of these big corporate manufacturing companies that are desperate for welders. Certain guys offer 20 bucks an hour plus full benefits, full corporate benefits 401k matching, you know boot allowance, you know all the medical options. Everything and I was like, so you’re telling me you you can be 18 years old come out of school with no debt making 40 grand a year when you’re 18 plus full benefits. And and then I go back and I look at what I was told is that you had to go to college to get a good job or you’re a piece of trash, you know, kind of stuff. And so, you know, I don’t know I’m, I’m frightened for the where we are now in the global community. You know, that’s a long rant, but I totally am excited that people like you are out there, also trying to help people sort out, you know, these different tracks that they can take in life.

Scott Sibley – SHAmory 10:37
Yeah, there. It’s all about no two, no two people are going to have the same journey pun intended, and making sure that that awareness is there to say, you know, there’s many ways to drive from point A to point B, there’s many alternative pathways like you just said, and college is not going to always be the one that’s on the top of the list going forward. Especially when you think how much you’re gonna spend. Okay, I could spend, you know, the next five years spending 200,000 dollars and come out with a piece of paper that may not be worth anything at the end of the day, because the jobs of the future changed over that time or like you just said, I can go into this welding certificate program, I can start making money right away in theory, potentially, and then make money while I keep growing into those next step of options. Like you said, it’s just kind of those stacks on stacks on stacks. And we had a similar a couple years back, we were working with the Western Regional carpenters union here in San Diego. And we didn’t notice before the going into the call of them, but the carpenters union nationally has a Western has a facility outside of Vegas, that’s a little over a million square feet. And you know, the problem one of the pain points they’re trying to solve is kids today think oh, being a carpenter. I’m just gonna go I’m gonna lay carpet, but no, at that facility, you can go there go through a certificate and apprenticeship program. They pay you 50 grand a year for a two year program. So you’re making money to your point going into debt, and you’re gonna come out of it with the with the ability to go into things like artificial intelligence, and more high tech fields where you know, you could be working on a drone as a carpenter, just like these pathways out there are endless. And part of it is goes back to that awareness factor where, like the carpenters union said, the kids in K 12. They don’t even know that we’re out there. Let’s make sure that that is there.

Rob McNealy – RobMcNealy.com 12:27
Well, you know, when I was growing up, we actually had auto shop class and we had metal shop and wood shop, but so many school districts around the country get rid of those programs, you know, which which is absurd. And I definitely know when I was growing up, you know, the teachers are always basically, you know, Pooh poohing blue collar kind of stuff, to the point where they make you feel guilty if you didn’t want to go down that track. I can tell you as someone you know, who is a strong disbeliever of the student loan trap And seeing what you know how much debt people take on, which for no ROI and, and you know, I mentioned off the air that, you know, my daughter is in college, our oldest and we had a lot of conversations about majors in what mom and dad were willing to pay for what we weren’t willing to pay for. One of the things that we said his parents said, we believe that it’s our responsibility to make it so our kids have enough training to be able to make a living and beyond their own when they’re an adult, right. We feel like we are responsible, that they have skills and education to be you know, you know, self success, self sufficient. And you know, we talked a lot because you know, when I went so, it was really funny. So for one semester, my daughter and I were going to community college together and she would like roll her eyes don’t walk with me, is really kind of funny because she couldn’t drive yet. But it was kind of fun, but i what i found though, it’s like literally for two Your electronics program at that community college you can go through and start off 56,000 a year, just doing like repairs to, you know, high tech equipment, you have a two year degree, they’re hot, and they’re poaching people out of these programs because these, there’s nobody with skills anymore. And I’m like, and I tell my daughter, look, this is a programming go to school at night, two years later, you’re making 50 K a year, you’re not going to have any debt. If not gonna end basically, we said we’re not going to pay for a low ROI bachelor’s degree, and spend, you know, 40 $50,000 on that when you can do two years and make more money. Rather than get this bachelor degree that pays 30 grand a year when you graduate. You know, you can start off in two years, you save a couple years of working or you get to work a couple extra years. So you have to include I think you have to include that opportunity cost of college right. You know, and but you know, we had a lot of discussions. She’s going chem-engineering now. And I fully support that. But you know, it’s interesting, you know where we’re going anymore. And I think part of the problem is you have teachers that don’t really either like, or don’t understand all these other trades, and all these other career options out there.

Scott Sibley – SHAmory 15:16
Yeah, that’s part of I mean, when we think of our map, so sitting here today, there’s a little under 2000 occupations on the map today, doesn’t matter how good of a teacher, guidance counselor, parent, whoever, you don’t know what those 2000s are, let alone You don’t know what the data attached to those 2000 are. So you need systems like journeys map like we’re in, we don’t think of ourselves as the end all be all. But the way we’ve built it out is to be able to say, We want others to both innovate into us and on top of us to be able to really let the system drive itself no different than if you’re calling an Uber. It can be leveraging Google Maps technology, you don’t even know it to know where you’re sitting, or you’re standing on the corner. That’s our same mindset where it’s a learning map, and we’re We’re building that foundation to also let other third parties innovate on top of, because we don’t want people to reinvent the wheel. And hopefully this is going to help. Whether it’s a Rob going back to get his welding degree a 10 year old or a military transition, it doesn’t matter to us, we want to help that lifelong learner.

Rob McNealy – RobMcNealy.com 16:18
Well, I think that’s important. And I think ultimately use a term that a lot of people aren’t familiar with. What is a lifelong learner?

Scott Sibley – SHAmory 16:25
Yeah. So in our eyes, that that goes back to encompassing the fact that wherever the way the world works today, you really are never going to stop learning. And really, it’s about those many journeys along the way that ultimately make up where you are from sitting there at birth through ultimately retirement really into retirement because you’re still learning then probably, and making sure that you’re taking down that barrier to say, you know, I graduated with my high school diploma, and kind of that’s a brick in the wall there and then it’s, it’s over, and then I got my degree and then learning is over. It’s never been gonna stop and tierpoint let’s say go in and I’m a marketing professional today. Well, sure, you may, let’s say you came out of that degree program with the best skills you could have. And you you’re extremely valuable to the company that hired you, you’re not going to be valuable to them 24 months down the line unless you keep learning what the new technology is in that field that you’re falling into. So you need a way to keep retooling yourself. And it goes back down to the skills, knowledge and abilities that are attached to these degrees that are attached to these programs that are attached to the certification that are really the true value add and from our work. The providers whether it’s a four year provider or certification program, that are starting to map their offerings down to the skill level, those are the ones that are going to be on the top of things and this next evolution of things in the in the learning continuum from our perspective.

Rob McNealy – RobMcNealy.com 17:54
I think we need to we need a culture of this kind of curiosity. Yeah. If there’s a way to stimulate that, and you know, I think that’s what you’ve done with Shaun Murray. So let’s talk about shomrei. What is SHAmory?

Scott Sibley – SHAmory 18:09
Sure. So in simple terms SHAmoryis a Bitcoin card game it happens to be like you mentioned the beginning, stem authenticated. So it’s the first Bitcoin card game that’s actually gotten official stem authentication as an educational product from stem org. The cool thing also about that authentication is the way stem.org does it is they actually leverage the blockchain to house all their credentials and certifications. So if you go and you can actually look it up on the blockchain that they’re using there, but uh, essentially, it’s a card game that starts bringing awareness and education around Bitcoin, and how mining works to really users of potentially any age. I like to think that you can play the game of memory, you can play the game of shomrei whether you’ve heard of Bitcoin or not, and it kind of walks through the process of how proof of work mining works in a fun, engaging, light hearted way that you can do with your brothers, your sisters, your friends, your family, and kind of a low stakes barrier to entry for kind of onboarding new Bitcoin. Individuals.

Rob McNealy – RobMcNealy.com 19:16
Where’d you come up with the idea for that? What inspired it?

Scott Sibley – SHAmory 19:19
So I think part of it just goes back to my history in education and then I full disclosure I’ve never mind that was never my my thing. But I started learning more about it just out of curiosity and wanting to learn how it worked. And as I started going through that process, along with learning everything else, I don’t want to I want to try to create something to be more involved in the space. And part of at least what I think of as part of my skill set is taking complex things and being able to boil them down into simple, digestible things that almost anybody can understand. So as I started learning more about mining and the way Sha 256 works for work, I boiled it down to the very basics, there are targets, and there are nonces. There are miners that do this work. But at the end of the day, in very basic terms, you want to find that nonce that’s going to bash that target. And once I had that concept down, I said, well, that’s very similar to playing memory, where you’re flipping over one card needs to match the other card. And then we take it one step further, where, well in mining, you know, it’s that hash rate the computer that’s using their, their power to go through and do this process where if you’re using memory, that’s really your power source and using that memory notion, to be able to be that driving factor between how the games play so I started making analogies like that, from there that the game was born.

Rob McNealy – RobMcNealy.com 20:46
Did you see this concept of, you know, making games out of other type of things like maybe just generic AI or generic blockchain? Have you looked at doing other games

Scott Sibley – SHAmory 20:58
I’ve looked at I definitely have it are out other types of games or expansions around how this could potentially work. JOHN Murray just so I watched pre orders in April, and actually just officially started shipping out about two weeks ago in early July. And so right now the focus is getting this, this one out there. And then whether it’s other games, I purposely, for those other Sema cards that kind of made with fun little characters, monsters that are really good for not only young kids, but they’re not to kitty that anybody can find them interesting. But the idea being those characters can also be a subset use case around video content, books, all those different ways that people can engage with these sorts of aspects of Bitcoin mining and that sort of thing is kind of the groundwork for future expansions.

Rob McNealy – RobMcNealy.com 21:53
Did you self publish this game? I mean, are you having it made up yourself and all that or are you working with like a game company to distribute it?

Scott Sibley – SHAmory 22:00
No, so it’s me, myself and I, my wife, why should say me, my wife helps doing a lot of the packing and getting things off and going from there, but I thought of it myself. I did hire a graphic designer. So I walked through kind of the design process with someone to actually create the the characters that I had in my head come to life, but then found a manufacturer which turned out to be a hiccup during the COVID experience that delayed things a little bit, given everything that was going on, but produced it gotta have been shipping ever since.

Rob McNealy – RobMcNealy.com 22:35
Is it hard to do? I mean, now that you look back on it, is this something that anybody could just build their own game like this? Or was it really a difficult journey to get to this point? I’ve never made a game before so but I’m an entrepreneur. So I’m always like, what does it take to make a game and what does it take to make a game?

Scott Sibley – SHAmory 22:54
It’s definitely anybody can do it. I think it probably a similar mindset to when you were talking about your welding I’m sure anybody who are interested enough, go do that program or similar type program, it just takes your motivation. And part of that process was okay. Well, like you said, I had never printed, you know, created a physical product before all my life. I’ve been in that edtech space where we’re recreating these digital projects and going through that QA and production and releases and that sort of structure. So it was learning to me but I was able to kind of go through that process even so I’m not a developer, but I you know, learn more about WordPress created the website myself was able to connect BTC pay to be able to accept both credit card and Bitcoin payments, be able to go through all those processes, the one that probably took the longest, which was the graphic design, where I wanted to ultimately at the beginning, I want to try to find a designer who had some knowledge of Bitcoin blockchain crypto in some way to be able to play off him or her. I wasn’t able to go that route. The end of the day, but I was able to find someone that it worked out to like, everything I dreamed of came to life. So it worked out in the end. But I would say that finding that graphic designer in the physical space was something that was a challenge. And then, given the pandemic, the actual manufacturing did present a challenge just given things in the shutdown and whatnot. But to your to your question, anybody can do it if you put your mind to it.

Rob McNealy – RobMcNealy.com 24:26
You know, I really agree with that with most things. I think that people underestimate their abilities. And you hear like, I mean, I’ve heard a lot from like in the startup space, especially when I was transitioning to my first business like a lot of people who don’t come from like an entrepreneurial kind of background. I think there was a statistic A while ago that I read that the children are entrepreneurs are like 75% more likely to become entrepreneurs, than people that like kids that are born just employees, right. And I think that makes a lot of sense, right? Because they’re used to being around their family. They’re used to seeing, you know, not necessarily having a weekly paycheck, right. They’re seeing, you know, their parents have to deal with, you know, cash flow and things like that. And I think they’re getting more comfortable with that. Whereas people who have never seen that, that scares the heck out of them. Yeah,

Scott Sibley – SHAmory 25:23
Totally. And I think it’s that side of things. Also, at least for me, personally, like I mentioned, so my dad’s were the entrepreneur side comes from him. It was his grandpa, who ran a farm back in Connecticut, growing up. And so it comes from that, that lineage and like you said, seeing it. Also, for me, it helps me see, you know, what, there’s more out there than just being an employee. I want to I want ultimately, to be able to really control my destiny, especially having you know, my wife, we have one daughter who’s one, we want to be able to have freedom and freedom to say, you know, I’m We want to go on this trip right now. Or we want to be able to not have to get up at the crack of dawn to be able to get somebody ready to get out the door to then do it all over again tomorrow. And so it’s that sense of freedom that I want to have for my family as we all keep growing together.

Rob McNealy – RobMcNealy.com 26:18
I tell people that the main reason you know I’m an entrepreneur is because I control my time. And to me, that’s so much more important than anything else. And people who are just used to being in that little rat maze every day of commuting and being in a you know, a little box or a warehouse all day long. That to me is like a death sentence. It’s like It’s like being in prison because I’ve done that right and I was miserable every time. You know, it’s funny because I got my my master’s degree and I worked in the corporate world for a few years and I was miserable, literally, literally depressed the whole time. I didn’t enjoy it didn’t didn’t like it did and it wasn’t that the work was bad. It was just this luck. I’m just sitting there feeling like I’m locked in a cell block all day long. And to me is I just don’t enjoy that I enjoy being able to do different things. And, you know, the beauty of my day job, you know, I have enough flexibility that I can work on our crypto project. And, you know, it’s like, I totally what you just said resonated with me because my wife and I made a decision. I don’t know maybe 10 years ago or so. We said we want to be geography independent for our livelihood. And to us that means that we could live anywhere because we felt that we wanted that that freedom and then homeschooling was part of that. And, you know, we look at homeschooling is just being entrepreneurs, for entrepreneurship for kids. Because really, it is and when I try to explain to people that you know, parents that have to pick up their kids drop their kids off, multiple kids a day multiple schools, multiple schools, events they spend more time doing that than we do on actually schooling our kids Yeah. And we don’t have to get up at six in the morning to do it.

Scott Sibley – SHAmory 28:10
You’re 100% correct.

Rob McNealy – RobMcNealy.com 28:13
But but it’s shocking because you tell people this and they’re like oh I could never do that I’m like yes you could you choosing not to you’re choosing not to explore it or figure it out but you absolutely could do it. You just have to be creative and flexible and a lot of people aren’t creative or flexible.

Scott Sibley – SHAmory 28:29
They like being in their box.

Rob McNealy – RobMcNealy.com 28:32
You know, I think that goes back to education though i think you know, even like when I was like, you know, when I was in welding school right, they only were talking about how you get a job as a welder, not how you start your own business as a welder not how do you become a weld inspector and an expert witness which is also being an entrepreneur consultant. So to me, I saw being a welder is like three four different weld tracks and then I also said, you know, in the welding in industry you could go work for like, you could go work in the industry like work for a welding menu like a weld welder manufacturer like Lincoln or Miller or one of those. And so once I got into that, and I’m pretty good at like jumping into something like crypto and taking a deep dive and learning like all the pieces, all the edges, you know, as I could very quickly and I’ve done this as a serial entrepreneur in multiple industries over the last 20 years and and I’m just like getting more creative, like Wow, I didn’t even know they had that, you know. But it’s interesting because like even now, I think the lifelong learning things important, you know, and I was a contractor during the last housing crash in 2007. And it was rough for a while for us and not because I did anything wrong, but a lot of my customers went out of business owing me a lot of money. A lot of money and I lost a lot of money because of it, not because of a mistake. I did But I learned from that point that I’m going to just do things to make myself more valuable in a variety of ways as fallbacks you know, kind of thing, you know, would have been great if I had a you know, another side hustle during that time period that could I could have easily jump back into. But so even like the welding thing, now, I weld a lot. I was welding for this interview, because I’m making things and I like to make things all the time and I’m getting better at it. And, you know, I could go get a welding job right now. or start a welding business on the side if I wanted to, and, but I also know that if I combine my welding school and welding abilities with my MBA, I could easily go work for a welding company, a big corporation, and do maybe outside sales outside of training. There’s a lot of things I could do now, that I couldn’t do before just because of that training. And it’s nice to me. I’m not scared. Like it gives me more confidence going forward that like, I know I could do this if I had to, or if I wanted to. But I like the other stuff, I’m doing better. And to me being a lifelong learner means just making yourself more valuable to other people.

Scott Sibley – SHAmory 31:11
100% that’s even when I was in college, part of the reason I differentiated myself from going and just getting a traditional business degree and chose to focus on accounting is, especially back then. So I was in college right around Enron and all that stuff. So when audit was you walk out of college with a job six months before you even graduated. And so I saw that I said, Okay, this is gonna get me on a pathway that I know, it’s not my passion. I know it’s not gonna make me it’s not gonna be what I want to do forever. But it’s going to differentiate me myself from the X amount of other people who are just focusing on the broad scope of business. And if I go that one step further, get a CPA license, that’s going to differentiate myself even more, while whether I do deserve it or not, it sets yourself apart from the crowd in different ways, as you keep kind of adding on things like that, and like you said, it can also always be a fallback, because obviously, I’m not using any of those skills today, it would take me a while to beat them back up. But if I needed to, I could.

Rob McNealy – RobMcNealy.com 32:17
But I just say, I probably disagree with that, though. I mean, you know, being an entrepreneur and managing a business, having a really good understanding of the numbers and bookkeeping and accounting are excellent skills. And and so many entrepreneurs don’t know how to do any of that stuff. And especially the tax piece. Now I’m fortunate, you know, as an entrepreneur I’ve been doing well. I’ve had so many LLCs and corporations, and I’ve had a lot of CPAs. But I do all my own bookkeeping, even now. I know enough about I’ve had enough college level accounting classes that I know and I know where to stop and I know when I shouldn’t be, you know, I have a really good CPA firm that word that I’ve been working with for 15 years and they’re amazing and but I still even now I mean to your lifelong learner, right? I, you know, because the crypto there’s a lot of tax nuances in crypto, like pretty deep dive stuff. And since not only am I involved with the crypto project, but I have my own personal crypto investments, you know, I have to understand that so I don’t get in trouble. And I was fortunate that my CPA got up to speed very quickly as well, you know, a couple years back that as well. But, you know, I’ve learned a lot about crypto taxes to the point where I feel pretty comfortable talking to other people and giving advice about you know, taxes, especially for at least newbies about what they need to deal with. I remember, and you probably saw this a couple years ago, remember when everybody’s like in back in 2017? Like, oh, you know, how many times did you hear people say something like, oh, there’s no taxes unless I cash out to Fiat? Yeah. Like, yeah, don’t tell that don’t put that on social media. The IRS will love you. But but that but I wouldn’t know that unless I was a lifelong learner, you know, and I’m just trying to get my And I’ll make myself smarter as much as I can. And I read every day, I listen to multiple books a month, you know, audiobooks, and things like that. And so I think that’s important going forward. Um, so, or about wrapping up here. How are you distributing the game? Where can people get it?

Scott Sibley – SHAmory 34:16
Yeah, so distributing through the website right now. So it’s shomrei comm sh, a, Mr. Y. So that’s the easiest place to go in there and get a get a deck for yourself, I did go ahead and make a promo code for any of your listeners. So you can get 10% off with the code, Rob 10. And that’ll drop that in at the checkout. And you’re welcome to use that. Obviously. So whether it’s the website, Twitter is play shomrei.com or excuse me, play shomrei handle and connect with us there or any other social media and obviously, myself, I’m Scott m de Sibley on Twitter as well but happy to engage throughout that process and where we send them out on daily basis. So Your order comes in. We’ll probably ship the next day, worldwide.

Rob McNealy – RobMcNealy.com 35:04
Well, that’s cool. And Scott, if you have any more updates going forward, feel free to come back on the show and update us. And I will have that, that discount code on the website at RobMcNealy.com. Scott, thank you so much for coming on today.

Scott Sibley – SHAmory 35:17
Thanks a bunch. Rob. Enjoy it.

Rob McNealy – RobMcNealy.com 35:19
Okay, folks, this Rob McNealy. Make sure you check us out on the web at RobMcNealy.com. Make sure you smash that subscribe button and help share to your friends. You have a great day, folks.

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